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Pakistan to develop 'advanced MLRS'

Hi,

Understandable---but still a massive difference in engineering.

Maybe someone can find out why has pof not chosen to manufacture howitzers---what has stopped them.
POF's primary focus is ordnance (e.g. bullets, artillery rounds, rockets, etc) and small arms.

I think the one that should be held responsible for howitzers is HIT. Most of Pakistan's state-owned defence companies operate like depots of the armed forces - they're not independent, and their work is basically shaped and driven by armed forces requirements. Howitzer production will depend on the Army to procure a system with ToT and to get HIT to produce it under license.

The ongoing bid for a 155 mm/52-cal wheeled self-propelled howitzer may be the starting point, e.g. Serbian news claimed Pakistan could be looking for 500 units, of which 400 would be built in Pakistan. If successfully secured, HIT would have a gun design it can adapt for wheeled SPH, towed, or even tracked SPH.
 
POF's primary focus is ordnance (e.g. bullets, artillery rounds, rockets, etc) and small arms.

I think the one that should be held responsible for howitzers is HIT. Most of Pakistan's state-owned defence companies operate like depots of the armed forces - they're not independent, and their work is basically shaped and driven by armed forces requirements. Howitzer production will depend on the Army to procure a system with ToT and to get HIT to produce it under license.

The ongoing bid for a 155 mm/52-cal wheeled self-propelled howitzer may be the starting point, e.g. Serbian news claimed Pakistan could be looking for 500 units, of which 400 would be built in Pakistan. If successfully secured, HIT would have a gun design it can adapt for wheeled SPH, towed, or even tracked SPH.

Hi,

Give them rifles---they will create an insurgency---but if you give them canons---they will create a nation with it.
 
what concerns me the most is why PAF isn't looking for guided cluster munition resembling cbu 105. it can make quick work of armored formations and will be a great weapon to counter cold start at very reasonable price.
instead they are looking for more tanks, gunships helicopters and MRLS which would be taken out by IAF
 
High precision on artillery rockets are always impressive. 10m CEP rate on a rocket offers impressive striking capabilities against any type of threats. If Turkey and Pakistan reach a deal to transfer the artillery systems, I think Both nation will benefit the mutual training, software and simulator capabilities. As far as I know, Pakistan uses Havelsan artillery training simulators.

Tr-122G

Tr-300G
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It sure is but for countries that lack any R&D in the rocket/missile field.

Pak (apart from Long range Ballistic and Quasi Ballistic missiles,Ground,Air and Sea launched CMs)... things like short ranged battlefield missiles,Short ranged multiple launch quasi ballistic missiles and MLRS.

Hence getting a 40 ranged guided MLRS is useless for us.

Specially when we have more advanced technology available locally.
 
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In a section of its 2015-2016 yearbook, the Pakistan Ministry of Defence Production (MoDP) outlined the development and/or procurement of “extended range guided MLRS [multiple launch rocket systems].” The previous year also listed in the continued production and development of MLRS technology.

Notes & Comments:

MLRS comprise of two main elements: rocket munitions and a self-propelled platform to carry and launch those rockets. Generally, rocket artillery provides several advantages over howitzer shells, such as longer range and heavier warheads. Many armies relied on the combination of mobility and numbers to deploy MLRS as fast-moving saturation attack assets.

Pakistan’s mainstay MLRS is the Kahuta Research Laboratories KRL-122. In recent years, the system was fit with the Pakistan Ordnance Factories (POF) Yarmuk 122 mm rocket. As per POF, the Yarmuk has a range of 20 km, though Global Industrial & Defence Solutions (GIDS) lists an extended-range 122 mm rocket with a range of 45 km. This is at-par with most overseas solutions, such as the Roketsan TR-122.

Based on the MoDP’s disclosure, Pakistan will be working to fit the Yarmuk-series of rockets with guidance systems and improve its accuracy. Currently, the Yarmuk has an accuracy of at least 80 m circular error probable (CEP), which is variable based on the launch elevation. On the other hand, the satellite-guided (INS/GPS) variant of the Roketsan TR-122 – i.e. TRG-122 – has a CEP of less than 30 m CEP.

Pakistan could emulate this model, though it will require modifying the Yarmuk to utilize a satellite-aided INS guidance suite and electro-mechanically actuated aerodynamic surfaces to achieve higher accuracy.

Roketsan marketed the TRG-122 to Pakistan in November at IDEAS, Pakistan’s biennial defence exhibition. Roketsan also revealed that Pakistan was also looking at 300 mm guided rockets (for which the Turkish company is offered its TRG-300). China’s NORINCO will likely be a leading contender for Pakistan’s rocket artillery requirements as well. According to Army Recognition, the NORINCO SR5 comprises of the 122 mm INS/GPS-guided BRE1, which has a range and accuracy of 40 km and 25 m CEP, respectively.

The pursuit of guided MLRS could also be a sign of the Pakistan Army increasing its reliance on network-enabled warfare. Efficient use of guided MLRS requires the artillery Fire Direction Centre (FDC) to have precise target location data, which could be had using forward observers or even intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (ISR)-enabled assets, such as helicopters, drones and armoured vehicles.

http://quwa.org/2017/05/04/pakistan-seeking-guided-multiple-launch-rocket-systems-mlrs/
 
Given M270 MLRS uses the M548 tracked carrier i.e. M113 based chassis for its system has a Pakistan not considered using its Al Qaswa tracked carrier for such purposes?

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @MastanKhan

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/heavy-industries-taxila-weapons-guide-and-specifications.35497/page-6

The HIT poster is showing M109s as part of their catalogue of products. Is this limited to local assembly of kits or actual howitzers indigenously?

Hi,

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) can better answer that question.
 
Given M270 MLRS uses the M548 tracked carrier i.e. M113 based chassis for its system has a Pakistan not considered using its Al Qaswa tracked carrier for such purposes?

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @MastanKhan

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/heavy-industries-taxila-weapons-guide-and-specifications.35497/page-6

The HIT poster is showing M109s as part of their catalogue of products. Is this limited to local assembly of kits or actual howitzers indigenously?
Assembly,overhauling,maintenance and rebuild factories.

Several components are also built in house.
 
Sir we were making the gun barels for our tanks.

Hi,

You are correct---but you have to dig deeper into the physics and engineering of the equipment---.

Simplistically---125 mm tank round has a range of 2 miles---155mm howitzer has a range of lobbing a shell around 20 miles.

And how heavy is that shell as compared to a tank round---quite heavy---plus the high explosive effect---.

It is not impossible---but doable with a right partner---.
 
Given M270 MLRS uses the M548 tracked carrier i.e. M113 based chassis for its system has a Pakistan not considered using its Al Qaswa tracked carrier for such purposes?

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @MastanKhan

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/heavy-industries-taxila-weapons-guide-and-specifications.35497/page-6

The HIT poster is showing M109s as part of their catalogue of products. Is this limited to local assembly of kits or actual howitzers indigenously?
Regarding an al-Qaswa MLRS, they theoretically could, but I think MLRS will be applied using wheeled platforms, namely trucks and possibly (though unlikely) AFVs. The Army's pursuit of wheeled self-propelled howitzers suggests that there's an emphasis on rapid mobility in the procurement of new systems. I'm not aware of HIT producing M109s, the catalogue reference could be for overhauling and upgrades.
 
Last year, Serbia sent 122 mm G-2000 rockets (extended range 40 km) to Pakistan for testing purposes.

http://www.un-register.org/ReportingStatus/CountryDetail.aspx?Register_Id=20421

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http://www.edepro.com/files/R122_G2000_Cargo.pdf
Advance technology made it possible to refurbish and enhance the range of 122mm MBRL rockets up to 45 Km as compared to its original range of 20 Km. Refurbished extended range version of the rocket has also undergone various design improvements which guaranties reliability and greater safety during operation.

http://gids.com.pk/refurbishment-range-enhancement-of-122mm-MBRL-ammunition
 
Finally good news hope it has max range with good accuracy may be rockets can be connected to gps for more pin point accuracy
 
Advance technology made it possible to refurbish and enhance the range of 122mm MBRL rockets up to 45 Km as compared to its original range of 20 Km. Refurbished extended range version of the rocket has also undergone various design improvements which guaranties reliability and greater safety during operation.

http://gids.com.pk/refurbishment-range-enhancement-of-122mm-MBRL-ammunition

POF is still producing 20 km range Yarmuk for KRL-122 (BM-11).

Is Azar (Type 83) using these 45 km range rockets developed by GIDS (with help from a foreign company) ?



Azar (Type 83) MLRS

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